Thursday, October 22, 2009

let it go now saxtons

My advice to the saxtons is - let it go.

"A father and his late son have lost an appeal against their convictions for the theft of greenstone (pounamu) from Ngai Tahu.

David Saxton, 62, and his son Morgan Saxton, 30 were found guilty in 2007 of the theft of hundreds of thousands of dollars worth of pounamu from South Westland's Cascade Plateau.
David Saxton was sentenced to two years and nine months imprisonment and his son to two years and six months jail.
They were also required to pay reparations of $300,000.
The pair launched an appeal against the convictions and sentence last year, but before the case was heard Morgan Saxton was killed in a helicopter crash in Wanaka in November."

Don't waste any more money on appeals and lawyers. Be thankful that we live in today's, not yesterday's world. You stole our taonga and got caught, got convicted and are paying the price to society and hopefully to Ngai Tahu financially. Let it go - it is done - but make sure you pay back the token $300,000.


Anonymous said...

It is a good outcome for the iwi. The Saxton's were being used in pawns by some Ngai Tahu individuals who want to claim the tribal assets for themselves.

I hope all of that is left behind us now.

Millsy said...

I dont see why iwi should keep all that greenstone for themselves?

Why cant others mine it and sell it?

This nation belongs to EVERYONE not the elite browntable,

Anonymous said...

Dear Millsy

Should we all be allowed to mine coal and gold and cut down trees as well? Or to just go and catch all the fish or to take all the water we need for ourselves.

Simple fact is that the pounamu (or greenstone to you) belongs to Ngai Tahu. Stealing is stealing whether it is $10 or trees or a tele or pounamu. If it is not yours then buy it or leave it where you found it.

Edward said...

That greenstone belongs to Ngai Tahu, not everyone. Saying it isn't is like saying your car or house belongs to EVERYONE (to use your love of scream writing). If it did there would probably be nothing left of it as seems evident from the Saxton fool's greed. How is their behaviour in any way representative of EVERYONE (lol) when they were just trying to cash in? Maori are custodians or gaurdians over their land, not plunderers. Seems everyone just means Pakeha to me.

Millsy said...

So who says it belongs to Ngai Tahu? I suppose next, we will have to go begging to Ngai Tahu to drink the river water, or take photos of the landscape next.

Our national parks belong to the people of this nation, not the iwi elite. Personally I think Ngai Tahu are just another money grubbing bunch of plunderers who want to screw every New Zealander, regardless of colour.

Anonymous said...

Well Millsy, there is an Act of Parliament that says pounamu belongs to Ngai Tahu - and unless you are advocating for overturning the rule of law on property rights that is pretty much it for that line of thought.

as for the rest, well if Fletcher Challenge and Fonterra and Tait Electronics are bad for wanting to make profits then so perhaps are Ngai Tahu. DoC already charges for the commercial use of the National Parks and this government is trying to work out how to charge for water, your problem it seems is that you object to Maori charging but not others,

Millsy said...

Yes, but Fletcher Challenge/Tait/Fonterra make things that people want to buy using raw materials they buy or own already.

They do not ask the government to take things in our national parks away from us so they can profit off them and leave other people impoverished.

The greenstone morally belongs to the people of New Zealand. Ngai Tahu have no right to keep it to themselves. As I said before, the iwi elite will stop at nothing to keep our national treasures to themselves and freeze out the rest.

BTW: I dont support *anyone* charging for water (or any other use of our national resources)

Edward said...

I don't mean too much offense by this, but I think you need a history lesson. You keep going on about our National Parks and how glad you are that "Maori can't take advantage of them" - where exactly do you think these came from? Thin air? Our largest and oldest park, Tongariro National Park, was put in control of the Crown by Maori. Here's a quote:

"To prevent exploitation of the mountains by European settlers, Te Heuheu Tukino IV (Horonuku), the most significant chief of the Māori Ngati Tuwharetoa iwi (or clan), gifted the heart of the current national park, consisting of the peaks of Mount Tongariro, Mount Ngauruhoe, and parts of Mount Ruapehu, to The Crown on September 23, 1887, on condition that a protected area was established there."

So, I guess that really shoots a hole through your rhetoric doesn't it? Perhaps it would pay to do a bit more wider reading before you open your mouth again, as I really do feel a bit embarrased for you.

The greenstone doesn't "morally belong to all of us" - I think you need to take a class in first year ethics my friend. 1. Ngai Tahu have rights as the tangata whenua. 2. Their history is associated with the area from before we pakeha arrived - these are their lands and resources.
3. There are cultural ties to the area and this particular resource which are not based on economics and should be respected.
4. Iwi have a responsibility to look after these resources for their people and into the future which, as far as I can tell, they seem to do a much better job than greedy big business.
5. The New Zealand Government, The law, the iwi, and scholars all agree this is the case.

So, who are you to demand it belongs to everyone (aka 'Pakeha') when everything else suggests otherwise? What are you or I going to do with the greenstone? Sell it? And what does it have to do with us? How has Ngai Tahu's ownership of this resource adversley affected yours or my own life? It hasn't. So what are you complaining about? The resource, or Maori, becuase to be honest it sounds like you just have a grude against the latter. I suggest either visiting the government website or iwi one to read more about it, because I don't think you know really what you're talking about.

Anonymous said...

millsy means to cause offence so we should waste no more ink on him or her.

simple facts are that if Maori are not to be allowed to own and manage those things that belong to them then no property rights will be safe. funny old world where Maori are expected to continue to carry the burden of economic wellbeing without the same tools as the rest of the nation.