We have very strong links to Samoa. I don't mean the fact we were a colonial power, but rather the large Samoan population here, the many family ties and the NZers living there.
An example is that I'm Pakeha but have Samoan family in NZ and in Samoa.
Yes there's an element of PR in sending Key but I'd hope it provides a measure of genuine solidarity as well. Of course it has to be done properly and not just be about PR (and yes I'm doubtful about that).
I actually find Labour's move in 'dispatching' Chris Carter over first harder to take.
I think it's up to the Samoan people as to whether this is a good thing. I'd certainly be interested in hearing about their experience of having Labour and National MPs showing up - and of the NZ response generally.
I don't agree the debate is good on BB. The original statements by BB are so laughable and obviously biased that the credibility of BB is once again demolished by her own words. The fact she used the same word set as a troubled TR Rep is interesting.
The crap and vitriol they are peddling will continue to make it hard for us to persuade good Ngai Tahu and good non-Ngai Tahu to work for our iwi.
Politicising the decision of a loyal employee of NTHC when he decides to leave the organisation to pursue his own career away from the iwi is shallow and pathetic. Suggesting he may have been forced out is to publically humiliate a person who has done nothing to attract this attention.
I note that you once again suggest his role might go to a Ngai Tahu person. I could not recomend to any of my whanau they subject themselves to the same old dumbf**k politics as we see here.
I suppose i think we need to send supplies and desalination plants and blankets and food and housing all before we send MP's or PM's. They will use much needed resources for what?
Kia ora second anon
I think that having a debate is good even though the contents of that debate might be 'debatable'. i have made my comment there but FFS 15 years is a pretty good go, so i see no issues. But the fact that others feel they can attack the iwi and individuals, well, that is not what I believe in.
And you are right we have an election that will shuffle the seats and at the end of it the same people with the same agendas will be there doing the same things. I would advise any of my whanau to hold fire about applying for any positions - but that really agitates me because it is the opposite of how i want it to be.
I think the issue with elections is that this type of bullshit has driven good people away from many runanga as well. Each runanga has its own challenges and although Richard is critical of the processes so far and what happened at the meeting to change the Charter he is wrong that it was the malcontents who led that charge.
The proposed changes to the electoral system were being proposed by lawyers and pedants and would have seen the most amazingly complex set of rules that would have further alienated our people.
The reality of local elections is played out in the Pakeha world as it is in our runanga world. A 23% particpation rate is high by local body standards. But the reality is that no-one really wants to be on the appointment committees. Good on Makaawhio for running an indicative vote.
I think what needs to happen is for the whanui out there to start coming to the hui-a-tau and demanding more of the Reps whoever they are.
We need to call out the destructive ones and write to them and their runanga everytime they step outside the bounds of good governance behaviour.
We need to know whether Richard P is telling the truth about Tahu being paid out 2x by Wally Stone. We hear all the time that Andrew H and Robin Pratt and others were paid huge sums when they left. I can live with people being paid well to work for us if we are getting value for money, but not to pay them to go away.
It will be interesting to see if this years annual accounts tell the full story on remuneration or not. There are rumours of Wally leaving sweetheart deals which cascaded down through HC. I don't want rumours, I want to know.
i agree we do need to know the truth about all the things you mention. But who will tell us? I can't see hui a tau being the forum but what are the alternatives.
I can't help think there are some who don't want the people to know what is/has been going on - let the sunlight in!
The problem comes from the fact that those people who get payouts usually seek confidential agreements. Sometimes it is the organisation who sought them. If I get to the hui-a-tau I hope that the questions will be asked.
Still Tahu and Wally might be there so may be we can ask them directly what the truth is. I recall that the majority of the NTHC board was removed some years ago and one of the reasons as I understand it was that they paid out their CE. If that is true then good for them.
One good question to ask is whether TR and NTHC have a policy on these things and when they adopted it.
it seems everyone gets the payout/off - double/triple dipping.
my experience of watching these payouts was that they were paid out and then they recipients formed a company and contracted back their services, to once again be on the gravy train - it definately is who you know not what you know.
All of the payout/offs use money that could be used to protect the water or the land... unfortunately too many have the pakeha disease of just always wanting more and more and invariably they want the money. i suppose being ripped off by your own is somehow less sad than being ripped off by others.
Be good to do an audit of the amounts paid out over the last few years and the amounts paid out now to Ngai Tahu members and non-Ngai Tahu. that would knock people over if they saw those figures.
a few ngai tahu have made far too much money on the back of the iwi
7 comments:
I'm undecided about this.
We have very strong links to Samoa. I don't mean the fact we were a colonial power, but rather the large Samoan population here, the many family ties and the NZers living there.
An example is that I'm Pakeha but have Samoan family in NZ and in Samoa.
Yes there's an element of PR in sending Key but I'd hope it provides a measure of genuine solidarity as well. Of course it has to be done properly and not just be about PR (and yes I'm doubtful about that).
I actually find Labour's move in 'dispatching' Chris Carter over first harder to take.
I think it's up to the Samoan people as to whether this is a good thing. I'd certainly be interested in hearing about their experience of having Labour and National MPs showing up - and of the NZ response generally.
Kia ora Marty
I don't agree the debate is good on BB. The original statements by BB are so laughable and obviously biased that the credibility of BB is once again demolished by her own words. The fact she used the same word set as a troubled TR Rep is interesting.
The crap and vitriol they are peddling will continue to make it hard for us to persuade good Ngai Tahu and good non-Ngai Tahu to work for our iwi.
Politicising the decision of a loyal employee of NTHC when he decides to leave the organisation to pursue his own career away from the iwi is shallow and pathetic. Suggesting he may have been forced out is to publically humiliate a person who has done nothing to attract this attention.
I note that you once again suggest his role might go to a Ngai Tahu person. I could not recomend to any of my whanau they subject themselves to the same old dumbf**k politics as we see here.
Kia ora first anon
I suppose i think we need to send supplies and desalination plants and blankets and food and housing all before we send MP's or PM's. They will use much needed resources for what?
Kia ora second anon
I think that having a debate is good even though the contents of that debate might be 'debatable'. i have made my comment there but FFS 15 years is a pretty good go, so i see no issues. But the fact that others feel they can attack the iwi and individuals, well, that is not what I believe in.
And you are right we have an election that will shuffle the seats and at the end of it the same people with the same agendas will be there doing the same things. I would advise any of my whanau to hold fire about applying for any positions - but that really agitates me because it is the opposite of how i want it to be.
Kia ora ano
I think the issue with elections is that this type of bullshit has driven good people away from many runanga as well. Each runanga has its own challenges and although Richard is critical of the processes so far and what happened at the meeting to change the Charter he is wrong that it was the malcontents who led that charge.
The proposed changes to the electoral system were being proposed by lawyers and pedants and would have seen the most amazingly complex set of rules that would have further alienated our people.
The reality of local elections is played out in the Pakeha world as it is in our runanga world. A 23% particpation rate is high by local body standards. But the reality is that no-one really wants to be on the appointment committees. Good on Makaawhio for running an indicative vote.
I think what needs to happen is for the whanui out there to start coming to the hui-a-tau and demanding more of the Reps whoever they are.
We need to call out the destructive ones and write to them and their runanga everytime they step outside the bounds of good governance behaviour.
We need to know whether Richard P is telling the truth about Tahu being paid out 2x by Wally Stone. We hear all the time that Andrew H and Robin Pratt and others were paid huge sums when they left. I can live with people being paid well to work for us if we are getting value for money, but not to pay them to go away.
It will be interesting to see if this years annual accounts tell the full story on remuneration or not. There are rumours of Wally leaving sweetheart deals which cascaded down through HC. I don't want rumours, I want to know.
Kia ora anon ano
Good comments!
i agree we do need to know the truth about all the things you mention. But who will tell us? I can't see hui a tau being the forum but what are the alternatives.
I can't help think there are some who don't want the people to know what is/has been going on - let the sunlight in!
The problem comes from the fact that those people who get payouts usually seek confidential agreements. Sometimes it is the organisation who sought them. If I get to the hui-a-tau I hope that the questions will be asked.
Still Tahu and Wally might be there so may be we can ask them directly what the truth is. I recall that the majority of the NTHC board was removed some years ago and one of the reasons as I understand it was that they paid out their CE. If that is true then good for them.
One good question to ask is whether TR and NTHC have a policy on these things and when they adopted it.
Yes anon
it seems everyone gets the payout/off - double/triple dipping.
my experience of watching these payouts was that they were paid out and then they recipients formed a company and contracted back their services, to once again be on the gravy train - it definately is who you know not what you know.
All of the payout/offs use money that could be used to protect the water or the land... unfortunately too many have the pakeha disease of just always wanting more and more and invariably they want the money. i suppose being ripped off by your own is somehow less sad than being ripped off by others.
Be good to do an audit of the amounts paid out over the last few years and the amounts paid out now to Ngai Tahu members and non-Ngai Tahu. that would knock people over if they saw those figures.
a few ngai tahu have made far too much money on the back of the iwi
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